Bobby Abreu, Mike Lieberthal Trade Rumor
From the Morning Call:
An intriguing trade rumor circulating has the Phillies sending All-Star outfielder Bobby Abreu and veteran catcher Mike Lieberthal to the Yankees in exchange for catcher Jorge Posada, pitcher Carl Pavano and third base prospect Eric Duncan. New Yankee bullpen coach Joe Kerrigan has been highly critical of how Lieberthal calls a game and it’s doubtful he’d endorse this swap.
Some might think I’m crazy, but, I would not do this deal. Lieberthal is on the downside and there’s something about Abreu that says “beware” to me. It could be that posse that he had at the All-Star game in Motown this year. Or, the fact that he’s looking more like a 20/30 guy instead of a 30/40 guy – not that there’s anything wrong with a 20/30 guy. It’s his OPS that concerns me – he’s probably more of a .880 guy now than a .970 guy. It’s a different game now, you know. And, I’ve heard that he’s Manny-like-moody.
I realize that the Yankees are dealing two huge questions marks here themselves, with a prospect, but, better the question marks that you know than the ones that you don’t know.
I’d do Abreu for Pavano. Eat some of the $$ so I don’t have to give up Duncan. But Posada stays. I wouldn’t trade him for Lieberthal
I’m with Raf. Whatever Posada might turn into in 2006-2007 is fine with me and I would hang onto him over Lieberthal. Lieberthal is an oft-injured guy and his hitting days are even further down the road than Jorgie’s. Pavano wants out so it’s sweet revenge to dump him into the cauldron of negativity that is Philly.
To come away with a CF who can hit like you’ve been asking for on the site for several weeks seems like you kill two birds with one stone. In the end, if our CF can hit 25 homers, swipe 20 bags and have an OPS of .880, I’m fine with that. Isn’t that better than what we’ve been getting out of Bernie since 2002 anyway? Not to mention, Abreu’s OBP is .411 for his career and not lower than .393 for any season that he’s been a regular player. If you’d pay Giles for his OBP and get, at best, half the homers, why wouldn’t you take Abreu’s numbers?
I’m not concerned about his or anyone else’s character. If there’s one thing about Torre I feel good about, it’s his interpersonal skills.
Steve, are you implying what I think you’re implying about Abreu? If you are, I’ve often wondered the same thing. He’s a nice player but if you’re right, he’s about an .860-.880 OPS not the threatening-to-go-4-figures type we’d justifiably salivate over. And, to add fuel to the fire, why is Philly so hot to trade him? Huh?
Exactly JohnnyC, exactly.
Actually, I think the Phils are trying to trade him because he’s Hispanic. You know how lazy and moody those people get sometimes. And hotheaded. It’s only a matter of time before he loses it and knifes someone. And that entourage? Nothing but trouble. You know how it is when those people get together. Who knows what kinds of drugs and guns they have. And they speak this weird language that only a few people can understand. I think they’re up to no good.
Probably not, but while we’re speculating and throwing out accusations…
Not in this context, but on Yankees Hot Stove show tonight they talked about Abreu being shopped around. Their new GM, Gillick I think?, is not afraid to make big moves to shake up the team, push them out of their complacency. This rumor doesn’t surprise me. There’s pressure from Tampa to dump Jorge. The problem is who would catch for us. Not Lieberthal, but he could be flipped in another trade. There are a couple of pretty good catchers on the FA market.
I read this clip in context and it left me wondering something. Why would it matter if Joe Kerrigan endorsed the trade? What cachet does he have to give a yay or nay? Just puzzled by that comment…
Let’s be consistent. If we think “Tampa” is behind every bad idea, then we should very well hope that Joe Kerrigan has some “cachet” since he’s Cashman’s hire, indeed was Cashman’s first choice to replace Stottlemyre (but Torre prevailed by anointing Yankee legend Ron Guidry based on, what?, of course, “trust”). Unless, of course, you think that Kerrigan is really just a double agent working for either Billy Connors or, heaven forfend, George himself! It must have been that mickey that Bill Emslie slipped in Brian’s martini. Or the post-hypnotic suggestion they gave him on the sly at the Magic Castle.
Johnny, there has been a ton of pressure from Tampa to dump Jorge, that’s been around so long I can’t remember the exact source, but it’s there. Kerrigan is a coach, period. He’s not an assitant GM. Yes, you listen to your coaches, but for him to be quoted in the actual article as if his opinion might make or break the deal, that’s a bit out there. I believe you actually meant “heaven forbid.” I’m not a conspiracy theorist. There is still tension between the two camps. Tampa wants some action. Cashman is being methodical. Those are the differences between the two groups. Unless, of course, post-hypnotic suggestion really works. Why do they have to ask our name when we call the psychic hotline?
Abreu’s career OPS is .937. What’s not to like about that? Even still, if it were in the .860-.880 range, would that not be an improvement over Bernie from 2002-2005? The last four years of Bernie have been pretty lousy. Would this not be an improvement. And would it not be an improvement over Pavano anyway? At this point, if we can get “only” a Bobby Abreu for a guy like Pavano, would it not make sense? I can’t come up with a single reason why Abreu wouldn’t be a good player to acquire. We were willing to bring in Giles. Their career OBP and OPS statistics are roughly the same, are they not?
Check that, his career OPS is .923. I stand corrected (but not by that much…)
I don’t like the idea either. Abreu is not a defensive upgrade at all and I’m not at all worried about our lineup.
Pavano has also (according to Susan Waldman) begged Cashman to STAY in New York. Supposedly he is desperate to remain in NY and prove himself a better pitcher than Yankee fans believe.
“I believe you actually meant ‘heaven forbid’.”
“Forfend” means “forbid”. “Heaven forfend” is idiomatic – see, e.g., _Othello_.
jonwilliams: I think you’re underestimating Abreu’s defense a bit. He’s a corner outfielder, so his range isn’t quite what we’re looking for with regards to a CF, but he’s a huge upgrade over Bernie/ Womack out there. And his arm is well above average.
Still, if we’re thinking CF defense, let’s just play Bubba.
I’m not saying that Pavano didn’t beg to stay but I would never cite Suzyn Waldman as a source. There are dead people that are more reliable than she is.