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	<title>Comments on: The 2006 A.L. MVP, Sabermetrically Speaking</title>
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	<link>http://waswatching.com/2006/09/04/the-2006-al-mvp-sabermetrically-speaking/</link>
	<description>Holy Cow! We never take cannoli from a huckleberry.</description>
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		<title>By: minnesotajoe</title>
		<link>http://waswatching.com/2006/09/04/the-2006-al-mvp-sabermetrically-speaking/comment-page-1/#comment-10365</link>
		<dc:creator>minnesotajoe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Sep 2006 09:50:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wp.waswatching.com/?p=1888#comment-10365</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s been a week and a half since anyone posted here, and anyone paying any attention to what&#039;s gone on during that week and a half of baseball would not only want to give the AL MVP to Justin Morneau, Joe Mauer, and Michael Cuddyer, but to Johan Santana as well.

It&#039;s no secret nor is it difficult to say that Johan Santana is the best pitcher in baseball this year, and with a 38-3 record after the All-Star break in each season since 2003 (9-0 this year), he may be even the best pitcher in baseball for the past 4 years, with a Cy Young award in &#039;04 and another one very likely this year.

Not only does Santana dwarf the rest of AL in most pitching categories this season, including the three triple crown categories with 18 wins, 230 K&#039;s, and an ERA of 2.75, but he beats out the NL pitchers in most of those categories also. In strikeouts, only two of the other nine pitchers in the top 10 of the MLB are in the AL. In ERA only three of the other nine are in the AL. Not only is Santana dominating the other pitchers in the American League, but the others in the National League as well, a league that supposedly favors pitching.

And if all those league-leading stats and Santana&#039;s record of 17-2 since May 2 isn&#039;t good enough for all you nay-sayers saying that pitchers shouldn&#039;t get the MVP, then get this: The twins are 26-5 in games that Santana has started this year. All eight of Santana&#039;s no decisions this year were ultimately still won by the Twins. In fact, the Twins haven&#039;t lost a game at home that Santana has started since August 1 of 2005, a game they lost 2-1. Why? Because of the undeniable clubhouse presence and leadership he brings to that dugout. When his team is batting, even in games that he&#039;s not pitching, he&#039;s in there on his feet cheering them on, giving them the confidence and inspiration to perform as well as he does.

Johan Santana is the morale captain of the Minnesota Twins. When he goes out on the mound for them, they win. Tonight, with only 16 games left in the regular season, the hot-hitting Twins face the Indians, sitting a single game behind Detriot in the AL Central lead for the first time since the second day of the year, and tonight he takes the mound for them in Cleveland vs. a pitcher who is 1-9.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><input type="button" value="Reply" onclick="CF_Reply('minnesotajoe');" /><input type="button" value="Quote" onclick="CF_Quote('co_10365','minnesotajoe');" /></div><span id="co_10365"><p>It&#8217;s been a week and a half since anyone posted here, and anyone paying any attention to what&#8217;s gone on during that week and a half of baseball would not only want to give the AL MVP to Justin Morneau, Joe Mauer, and Michael Cuddyer, but to Johan Santana as well.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s no secret nor is it difficult to say that Johan Santana is the best pitcher in baseball this year, and with a 38-3 record after the All-Star break in each season since 2003 (9-0 this year), he may be even the best pitcher in baseball for the past 4 years, with a Cy Young award in &#8217;04 and another one very likely this year.</p>
<p>Not only does Santana dwarf the rest of AL in most pitching categories this season, including the three triple crown categories with 18 wins, 230 K&#8217;s, and an ERA of 2.75, but he beats out the NL pitchers in most of those categories also. In strikeouts, only two of the other nine pitchers in the top 10 of the MLB are in the AL. In ERA only three of the other nine are in the AL. Not only is Santana dominating the other pitchers in the American League, but the others in the National League as well, a league that supposedly favors pitching.</p>
<p>And if all those league-leading stats and Santana&#8217;s record of 17-2 since May 2 isn&#8217;t good enough for all you nay-sayers saying that pitchers shouldn&#8217;t get the MVP, then get this: The twins are 26-5 in games that Santana has started this year. All eight of Santana&#8217;s no decisions this year were ultimately still won by the Twins. In fact, the Twins haven&#8217;t lost a game at home that Santana has started since August 1 of 2005, a game they lost 2-1. Why? Because of the undeniable clubhouse presence and leadership he brings to that dugout. When his team is batting, even in games that he&#8217;s not pitching, he&#8217;s in there on his feet cheering them on, giving them the confidence and inspiration to perform as well as he does.</p>
<p>Johan Santana is the morale captain of the Minnesota Twins. When he goes out on the mound for them, they win. Tonight, with only 16 games left in the regular season, the hot-hitting Twins face the Indians, sitting a single game behind Detriot in the AL Central lead for the first time since the second day of the year, and tonight he takes the mound for them in Cleveland vs. a pitcher who is 1-9.</p>
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		<title>By: hopbitters</title>
		<link>http://waswatching.com/2006/09/04/the-2006-al-mvp-sabermetrically-speaking/comment-page-1/#comment-10364</link>
		<dc:creator>hopbitters</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Sep 2006 17:55:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wp.waswatching.com/?p=1888#comment-10364</guid>
		<description>I think &quot;advanced&quot; just refers to anything beyond what you&#039;d read in your average boxscore or sports page. As for RCAA, I think it has value as a comparative offensive statistic. Lee tends to use it as a comprehensive statistic, which it is not, but that shouldn&#039;t diminish its usefulness in the proper context.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><input type="button" value="Reply" onclick="CF_Reply('hopbitters');" /><input type="button" value="Quote" onclick="CF_Quote('co_10364','hopbitters');" /></div><span id="co_10364"><p>I think &#8220;advanced&#8221; just refers to anything beyond what you&#8217;d read in your average boxscore or sports page. As for RCAA, I think it has value as a comparative offensive statistic. Lee tends to use it as a comprehensive statistic, which it is not, but that shouldn&#8217;t diminish its usefulness in the proper context.</p>
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		<title>By: christopher</title>
		<link>http://waswatching.com/2006/09/04/the-2006-al-mvp-sabermetrically-speaking/comment-page-1/#comment-10363</link>
		<dc:creator>christopher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Sep 2006 12:30:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wp.waswatching.com/?p=1888#comment-10363</guid>
		<description>Why are these statistics refered to as &quot;advanced&quot;?  Any stat that says Melvin Mora and Geoff Jenkins are the most clutch players in their respective leagues cannot be taken seriously.  Those guys haven&#039;t played in an important game all year.  And any stat that says Shawn Chacon is a better clutch hitter than ARod...well, I guess some Yankee fans would agree with that.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><input type="button" value="Reply" onclick="CF_Reply('christopher');" /><input type="button" value="Quote" onclick="CF_Quote('co_10363','christopher');" /></div><span id="co_10363"><p>Why are these statistics refered to as &#8220;advanced&#8221;?  Any stat that says Melvin Mora and Geoff Jenkins are the most clutch players in their respective leagues cannot be taken seriously.  Those guys haven&#8217;t played in an important game all year.  And any stat that says Shawn Chacon is a better clutch hitter than ARod&#8230;well, I guess some Yankee fans would agree with that.</p>
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		<title>By: #15</title>
		<link>http://waswatching.com/2006/09/04/the-2006-al-mvp-sabermetrically-speaking/comment-page-1/#comment-10362</link>
		<dc:creator>#15</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Sep 2006 11:23:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wp.waswatching.com/?p=1888#comment-10362</guid>
		<description>How about &quot;clutchivity&quot;. Really want DJ to win it (he made his team a winner), but Papi probably gets the nod (two years running at the top of the hitting game, health scare, dangerous close and late, ESPN poster boy). DH&#039;s should have to overwhelm to have a chance to win the MVP. Maybe Hafner, Ortiz, Giambi, Thomas and Thome will split he DH vote and push Jeter over he top. Manny and Johnny both deserve more ink, as well as Morneau and Mauer (I&#039;m partial to catchers that can swing the stick especially late in the year). Batting title got real close after yesterday. Tejada ought to be eliminated from the race because he hasn&#039;t had a meaningful AB in two years.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><input type="button" value="Reply" onclick="CF_Reply('#15');" /><input type="button" value="Quote" onclick="CF_Quote('co_10362','#15');" /></div><span id="co_10362"><p>How about &#8220;clutchivity&#8221;. Really want DJ to win it (he made his team a winner), but Papi probably gets the nod (two years running at the top of the hitting game, health scare, dangerous close and late, ESPN poster boy). DH&#8217;s should have to overwhelm to have a chance to win the MVP. Maybe Hafner, Ortiz, Giambi, Thomas and Thome will split he DH vote and push Jeter over he top. Manny and Johnny both deserve more ink, as well as Morneau and Mauer (I&#8217;m partial to catchers that can swing the stick especially late in the year). Batting title got real close after yesterday. Tejada ought to be eliminated from the race because he hasn&#8217;t had a meaningful AB in two years.</p>
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		<title>By: baileywalk</title>
		<link>http://waswatching.com/2006/09/04/the-2006-al-mvp-sabermetrically-speaking/comment-page-1/#comment-10361</link>
		<dc:creator>baileywalk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Sep 2006 04:24:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wp.waswatching.com/?p=1888#comment-10361</guid>
		<description>Clutchiness?  That&#039;s my new favorite word.  It kind of sums up how unbelievably silly the whole sabermetrics thing can get.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><input type="button" value="Reply" onclick="CF_Reply('baileywalk');" /><input type="button" value="Quote" onclick="CF_Quote('co_10361','baileywalk');" /></div><span id="co_10361"><p>Clutchiness?  That&#8217;s my new favorite word.  It kind of sums up how unbelievably silly the whole sabermetrics thing can get.</p>
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		<title>By: dbvader</title>
		<link>http://waswatching.com/2006/09/04/the-2006-al-mvp-sabermetrically-speaking/comment-page-1/#comment-10360</link>
		<dc:creator>dbvader</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Sep 2006 03:49:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wp.waswatching.com/?p=1888#comment-10360</guid>
		<description>Would people please stop using the word &#039;invent&#039; to refer to people creating new statistics?  Invent has much more significance than finding a new way to manipulate numbers.
It is especially silly when applied to Lee Sinins&#039; &#039;invention&#039; of RCAA.  All Lee did was take another statistic, which was original, and add an element to compare it with the average.  He didn&#039;t invent squat.  Besides, RCAA as Lee uses does not come close to actual production.  Because of this fact, the statistic should be questioned as a comprehensive statistic.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><input type="button" value="Reply" onclick="CF_Reply('dbvader');" /><input type="button" value="Quote" onclick="CF_Quote('co_10360','dbvader');" /></div><span id="co_10360"><p>Would people please stop using the word &#8216;invent&#8217; to refer to people creating new statistics?  Invent has much more significance than finding a new way to manipulate numbers.<br />
It is especially silly when applied to Lee Sinins&#8217; &#8216;invention&#8217; of RCAA.  All Lee did was take another statistic, which was original, and add an element to compare it with the average.  He didn&#8217;t invent squat.  Besides, RCAA as Lee uses does not come close to actual production.  Because of this fact, the statistic should be questioned as a comprehensive statistic.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Lombardi</title>
		<link>http://waswatching.com/2006/09/04/the-2006-al-mvp-sabermetrically-speaking/comment-page-1/#comment-10359</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Lombardi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Sep 2006 02:38:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wp.waswatching.com/?p=1888#comment-10359</guid>
		<description>I just when with the names that everyone in the media says should be in the MVP race.

You always hear Papi - and never Manny.

I don&#039;t agree with it, but, that&#039;s what you hear from the voters.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><input type="button" value="Reply" onclick="CF_Reply('Steve Lombardi');" /><input type="button" value="Quote" onclick="CF_Quote('co_10359','Steve Lombardi');" /></div><span id="co_10359"><p>I just when with the names that everyone in the media says should be in the MVP race.</p>
<p>You always hear Papi &#8211; and never Manny.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t agree with it, but, that&#8217;s what you hear from the voters.</p>
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		<title>By: hopbitters</title>
		<link>http://waswatching.com/2006/09/04/the-2006-al-mvp-sabermetrically-speaking/comment-page-1/#comment-10358</link>
		<dc:creator>hopbitters</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Sep 2006 00:38:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wp.waswatching.com/?p=1888#comment-10358</guid>
		<description>How&#039;d you pick those candidates, Steve? I would have at least looked at the top pitchers. And if you&#039;re going to include Ortiz, then you ought to consider Manny, who is better offensively and sometimes even shows up in the field, and Hafner, who leaves the rest of the AL in the dust offensively.

My opinion of WPA, Clutchiness, etc. is well-documented, so I won&#039;t rehash it.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><input type="button" value="Reply" onclick="CF_Reply('hopbitters');" /><input type="button" value="Quote" onclick="CF_Quote('co_10358','hopbitters');" /></div><span id="co_10358"><p>How&#8217;d you pick those candidates, Steve? I would have at least looked at the top pitchers. And if you&#8217;re going to include Ortiz, then you ought to consider Manny, who is better offensively and sometimes even shows up in the field, and Hafner, who leaves the rest of the AL in the dust offensively.</p>
<p>My opinion of WPA, Clutchiness, etc. is well-documented, so I won&#8217;t rehash it.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Lombardi</title>
		<link>http://waswatching.com/2006/09/04/the-2006-al-mvp-sabermetrically-speaking/comment-page-1/#comment-10357</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Lombardi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Sep 2006 23:56:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wp.waswatching.com/?p=1888#comment-10357</guid>
		<description>Plus, I have to wonder if Damon is not on the team, and Jeter has to bat lead-off, if Jeter&#039;s numbers would suffer some then.....
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><input type="button" value="Reply" onclick="CF_Reply('Steve Lombardi');" /><input type="button" value="Quote" onclick="CF_Quote('co_10357','Steve Lombardi');" /></div><span id="co_10357"><p>Plus, I have to wonder if Damon is not on the team, and Jeter has to bat lead-off, if Jeter&#8217;s numbers would suffer some then&#8230;..</p>
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		<title>By: brockdc</title>
		<link>http://waswatching.com/2006/09/04/the-2006-al-mvp-sabermetrically-speaking/comment-page-1/#comment-10356</link>
		<dc:creator>brockdc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Sep 2006 23:48:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wp.waswatching.com/?p=1888#comment-10356</guid>
		<description>While I do hope that Jeter wins, I find it hard to believe that Damon isn&#039;t a bigger part of the conversation. While Jeter&#039;s OBP is better than Damon&#039;s (.418 to .371), Damon sees more pitches on average and has slugged at a higher rate (.515 to .482). Jeter&#039;s BA bests Damon&#039;s by 40 points, but Damon has twelve more homers. The other mainstream offensive categories are fairly close, but Damon has played an exceptional centerfield this year; and he absolutely destroyed the Sox in the biggest series of the regular season.

I&#039;m not saying Damon should win it, just that he should be much higher on everyone&#039;s MVP list.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div class="comment-toolbar" style="text-align: right"><input type="button" value="Reply" onclick="CF_Reply('brockdc');" /><input type="button" value="Quote" onclick="CF_Quote('co_10356','brockdc');" /></div><span id="co_10356"><p>While I do hope that Jeter wins, I find it hard to believe that Damon isn&#8217;t a bigger part of the conversation. While Jeter&#8217;s OBP is better than Damon&#8217;s (.418 to .371), Damon sees more pitches on average and has slugged at a higher rate (.515 to .482). Jeter&#8217;s BA bests Damon&#8217;s by 40 points, but Damon has twelve more homers. The other mainstream offensive categories are fairly close, but Damon has played an exceptional centerfield this year; and he absolutely destroyed the Sox in the biggest series of the regular season.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not saying Damon should win it, just that he should be much higher on everyone&#8217;s MVP list.</p>
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