• Vicente Padilla

    Posted by on November 30th, 2006 · Comments (11)

    Dan Granziano is reporting that the Yankees are keeping a tab on Free Agent pitcher Vicente Padilla.

    Padilla has always managed to be close to a league average pitcher.

    I read once that he’s looking for a 4-year deal at $10 million-a-year. Sounds like Pavano to me. At that price, I would pass.

    Comments on Vicente Padilla

    1. Raf
      November 30th, 2006 | 10:56 am

      I think Padilla’s a bit more durable than Pavano. In this market, that contract may actually be reasonable.

    2. Chewbacca
      November 30th, 2006 | 12:39 pm

      Steve,

      If you are going to pass, the money is once again irrelevant. The only advantage the Yankees have over the rest of the league is their money. That is precisely why MLB tried to institute a salary cap and why they settled for luxury tax.

      Depending on whether he is a Type A or B free agent, the only reasons to pass on him would be because you thought he wouldn’t make our team better or because we can only sign a limited number of Type A or B free agents.

      I am sick and tired of people talking about the money and Brian Cashman talking about cutting payroll. When your only advantage is the money, you have to use it.

    3. November 30th, 2006 | 12:57 pm

      I’m not saying to pocket the money – just spend it where the ROI makes more sense.

    4. Raf
      November 30th, 2006 | 2:25 pm

      I am sick and tired of people talking about the money and Brian Cashman talking about cutting payroll. When your only advantage is the money, you have to use it.
      ====================
      Spending $$ isn’t the be-all end all, you have to spend wisely. Throwing a bucket of $$ at a player because they’re on the market is insane. There are deals to be had out there, they just have to be creative about it. Look how well the Twins and A’s, to name but two organizations, have been run.

      And $$ isn’t the only advantage the Yanks have over other teams

    5. mehmattski
      November 30th, 2006 | 2:58 pm

      I agree, Raf… and what exactly is the advantage of all the other teams, that the Yankees don’t have? Farm system? Scouting? Ball park facilities? Better fan giveaways? It’s not all about the money, it’s all about making smart baseball and business decisions.

      Besides, clearly the best reason to go for Padilla is that his name is really fun to say with a fake Spanish accent. I can almost hear John Sterling botching his name now…

    6. Chewbacca
      November 30th, 2006 | 3:29 pm

      Unfortunately, we are not the Twins and the A’s. We rarely get production out of the Jasont Tyner/ Bartletts of the MLB or Aaron Small/Shawn Chacon of ’05. We do not even get the expected production of Randy Johnson/A-Rod. Everyone can say that Randy Johnson was old when he came to the Yankees, but he was probably the most dominant NL pitcher just 4 months prior to becoming a Yankee. Apparently, in those 4 months, he lost 4 MPH off his fastball. How is that even possible?

      As for money, people demand more to play in New York and “aint nobody” giving us a hometown discount.

      2nd, ss for our farm system, sure, it may be one of the top 10 in baseball. However, team officials and general managers, because of stupidity, listen to people like Peter Gammons and Buster Olney, people who cant spit out fast enough the newest Red Sox prospect on the radar but fail to ever mention even Phil Hughes.

      We very well could have spent 150 million to get both Igawa and Matsuzaka for depth, or even if just to stash them on the 60 day DL, just to keep them from the Red Sox. And then we still could of gotten the limit of 4 Type A/B free agents.

      Notice how Brian Cashman had to wait to pick up Sheffield’s option until he had a deal in place, because “God Forbid” he spend 13 million to pick up his option and then trade him two months later. Look at what the Red Sox are going to get for Ramirez. Sure, you may say that he is far better than Sheffield. But, in reality, he is not that much better than Shef and Shef is more of a bargain with all the deals that have gone down. If pinch-a-penny Cash picked up the option and waited a month or two, we could have gotten major league ready talent like the Red Sox are going to get. But, Cash couldnt take the chance that the richest sports franchise might have to eat 13 million.

    7. Raf
      November 30th, 2006 | 4:00 pm

      Believe it or not, you got the expected production out of ARod. How is it possible that RJ loses 4mph? Back problems, among other factors.

      As for the “hometown discount,” Mussina could’ve gotten more on the open market.

      As for salary dumps, the Yanks have done it before; remember the Jack Clark trade?

      What makes you think Cash would’ve been able to unload Sheffield later? What was wrong with pitching him now? It worked out perfectly; Yanks got some arms, the Tigers got an OF’er, and Sheffield got his contract extended. Wins all aorund.

      As for the Red Sox, they have tried to move Manny ever since they signed him. Actually put him on waivers and no team claimed him. If there was a deal to be had, the Sox would’ve made it already. Now he’s a 10-5 player and can veto any trade he wants.

      Despite their troubles last season, the Yanks won 97 games. They’ll be ok in 2007; they need to be fine tuned.

    8. Chewbacca
      November 30th, 2006 | 5:09 pm

      First of all, the Jack Clark trade was before the YES network and the 4 World Series in 5 years that made us the cash cow we are now.

      Secondly, the problem with trading Sheffield was that we traded him before all the outrageous contracts were give to players that were clearly his inferior…Soriano or Lee anyone. If Cashman had waited out the market, we could have gotten a far greater package than we did because of Sheffield’s affordability for projected production in the current market. And the reason we traded him before all the outrageous contracts were given out was because there was a certain date by which we had to pick up Sheff’s 13 million dollar option and Cashman decided that he had to make sure he had a deal in place for a trade before he picked up the option. My contention is, being that the Yankees have very little money constraint, what effect does having a trade already in place have on picking up his option. The answer is, that there is no effect except that Cashman is a penny pincher who was afraid of getting stuck with Sheff, instead of realizing that we could easily eat his 13 mil and still thrive.

      This is exactly what I am talking about when I say that our only advantage over everyone is the money. The point is every other team has farm systems, scouts, and whatever else you want to point out. Everyone has those as possibilities whether they pan out or not. But no other team has the possibility to just eat a 13 million dollar contract and not bat an eyelash. We ought to take advantage of that and give out crazy contracts to screw up the market for other teams. Just think, if we won the bid for Matsuzaka, we could have signed him to a 4 year deal worth 20 million per year and that would have so blown up the pitching market that whoever signed Zito or Schmidt would have had to spend like 18-20 million a year themselves. Basically other teams are taking the money that we have to pay in revenue sharing and they use that money to give out bigger contracts. We ought to force them to pay the kind of contracts that would be more difficult for them to handle by establishing the market at even more outrageous rates than they are at now. Why not offer Lilly a three year deal at 15 mil a year. That would absolutely blow up the mid level starters market and force every midrage starter like Suppan or Weaver or Meche to think that they could get 15 mil a year basically make it impossible for all but a few teams…like ourselves to sign them. That is our biggest advantage and we completely ignore it.

    9. Raf
      November 30th, 2006 | 5:34 pm

      That’s just plain lunacy.

      Any team that signed a player to that kind of contract was able to move them. Texas was able to move ARod & Chan Ho Park. The Rockies were able to move Mike Hampton, the Dodgers were able to move Kevin Brown, so on and so forth.

      Besides, if the Yanks were to blow up the market for a player, it doesn’t necessarily mean it sets the market. Could be an outlier. And if you sign all these players where are you going to put them on the roster? Your idea works only if the Yanks sign every player.

      It doesn’t make sense to go after a “name” player when you can get similar if not better production at a fraction of the cost, even more so if the point is to keep them away from another team.

      With Sheffield it’s quite simple; they had no need for him, they picked him up and got 3 serviceable arms for him. For a player that they had no use for, they got some value in return, as opposed to letting him walk for nothing. Same with the Wright trade. For a player they had little use for, they got value in return.

    10. Chewbacca
      November 30th, 2006 | 6:16 pm

      First of all, I never said anything about moving big contracts so I have no idea what you are talking about there.

      Secondly, you just avoid outliers by not going to far about the cost like Texas did with Arod. Giving Ted Lilly 15 mil a year isnt an outlier because Zito would make just as much right now, it would just make Zito more expensive.

      Thirdly, the problem with trying to get similar production at a fraction of the cost of a name player, is that you have to HOPE that you get similar production. The fact is, they are name players because of their production, which has already been established. If you try to get the same production at less the cost, then you must be giving up something else in return, and that something else is the lesser percentage chance that you will get similar production. For instance, you can assume that Jeff Karstens or Darrell Rasner will give you similar production to Gil Meche, but you cant guarantee it. Gil Meche is a proven pitcher that you pretty accurately predict will do, while Karstens or Rasner have no resume on which to base a prediction except a small sample size of major league inning and a minor league career. In essence I am saying this, you have a higher percentage of predicting accurately what you will get from Meche that you do from Karstens or Rasner.

      Finally, with Sheffield I am saying that letting Sheffield go for nothing, never should have even been an possibilty. Cashman should have picked up his option as soon as he was able to, and then spent sometime assessing the market for him. He should not have been worried about having a deal in place before he picked up the option because even if it became difficult to trade him, we could always have just payed the entire 13 mil and then any team would gladly have taken Sheff for free for a year and they would have given us something reasonable in return. But that more than likely wouldnt have happened anyway since once the markent exploded, teams would have been all over us to get Sheff rather than pay a mediocre Carlos Lee 100 million dollars or any of the other weak free agents on the market. We could easily afford to just eat the 13 mil but as I said before, penny pinching Cash basically decided he had two choices….1. let Sheff go for nothing, (which should never have entered his mind) or 2. make sure he had a trade in place before he picked up the option so we wouldnt get stuck with 13 million dollars if the market for Sheff suddenly dried up (which the market never would have dried up he should have realized if he had any brains).

    11. Raf
      November 30th, 2006 | 10:25 pm

      First, the point about moving contracts is countering your idea that “we ought to take advantage of that and give out crazy contracts to screw up the market for other teams.” Eventually, the contract is going to have to be moved, and on top of already paying whatever penalty is assessed for going over the threshold, you’re going to have to include a suitcase of $$ in the deal just to get rid of the player. Not smart.

      Giving Lily $15M a year is stupid, and a team that would sign him to that deal deserves whatever they get. More power to Lily for scoring that kind of deal.

      Exactly, the “name” player already is established. You think Karstens or Rasner can give 5 innings per start and keep their ERA around league minimum? Because if they can, you’ve just replaced Jaret Wright at a fraction of the cost. Hell, the contract that Wright signed, you had to HOPE that he would repeat his 2004, which was a longshot. Same with Pavano. You don’t think either one of Kartsens or Rasner, or whomever can duplicate what they did? Matt Clement signed with the Sox for less than Pavano signed for here. He outperformed Pavano, for less $$. You definately have an idea of what Meche can do. Suck… Given their track records and skillset, you have an idea of what they can do; they have minor league equivalency calculations.

      With Sheffield, there was no need to pick up his option. There’s the possibility that he doesn’t get moved, tying up a roster spot. The deal has to make financial sense. Eating the contract (a salary dump) serves no purpose because you will not get nearly anything servicable back in return. Let’s say the Yanks follow your scenario; where do they trade him to? You don’t think the idea was floated to trade him to Houston or SF or wherever? Maybe the Tigers offered the best package. Eating a contract that size is pointless.

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