Cashman Meets Boras
Via George King -
Brian Cashman and Scott Boras met today to go over the agent’s high-end free agent shopping list that includes Mark Teixeira, Manny Ramirez, Derek Lowe and Oliver Perez.
It’s the second time in a month Cashman and Boras have met; they had dinner at the GM Meetings in early November in Southern California.
Though it was confirmed Cashman and Boras met, talk of them doing so in California was incorrect. And the meeting was not held in New York.
With CC Sabathia not jumping at the Yankees’ six-year, $140 million package and the Braves apparently ready to offer A.J. Burnett a five-year deal worth $75 million, the Yankees might have to overpay for Lowe, whose first preference is going back to Boston.
“They will go all offense,” a baseball official predicted of the Yankees if they fail to land two of the top three free agent pitchers.
That could mean bringing switch-hitting Teixeira to play first base or signing Ramirez to play the outfield or DH.
It’s Cashman 101: Can’t come up with pitchers; so, add hitters.
That worked fine when you got to play the O’s and the Rays 38 times a year and their pitchers stunk – it was a good way to get regular season wins (although the team would then pay the price in the post-season when they faced good pitchers). But, the Rays can pitch now. So, this approach may be totally flawed at this point…
“It’s Cashman 101: Can’t come up with pitchers; so, add hitters.”
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So ya think it’s a bad idea Steve?
If we CAN’T get quality pitching, what would YOU suggest as Plan B?
It’s Cashman 101: Can’t come up with pitchers; so, add hitters.
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I’m not sure why you are so against trying to sign good hitters all of a sudden. Can you really love Brett Gardner that much? I mean, sure, you can say pitching and defense wins Championships, but that is premised on the fact that your team can also *score* some runs. Indeed, there are ultimately two important things in baseball: scoring runs and preventing runs.
Again, the problem last year was the hitting, not the pitching. We have our top 2 pitchers returning (we hope at full health), maybe our 4th pitcher in Pettitte, and anybody we put out there will be better than our 5th starter last year.
Our pitching was more than acceptable last year. IF we re-sign Pettitte, we are basically trying to replace Mussina and anything else should be seen as improving on last’s years acceptable rotation.
Yes, I want CC. He will help our team a lot. That said, you are acting as thought pursuing hitters is a bad idea. There was/is far more room to improve our hitting from last year than our pitching, as all statistics from last year prove.
it was a good way to get regular season wins (although the team would then pay the price in the post-season when they faced good pitchers).
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I think you should take a closer look at the games before you come to that conclusion.
@ OldYanksFan — “If we CAN’T get quality pitching, what would YOU suggest as Plan B?”
No need to ask. Just take a gander at the posts and comments this week: he’d rather resign Andy for more than the Yankees are willing to pay for his services, and say a prayer.
~~If we CAN’T get quality pitching, what would YOU suggest as Plan B?~~
Get a GM who knows how to find good pitching.
“Get a GM who knows how to find good pitching.”
I don’t think Brian Cashman can sign GMs.
But, good luck with that anyway.
~~If we CAN’T get quality pitching, what would YOU suggest as Plan B?~~
Get a GM who knows how to find good pitching.
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Like which other GM this off-season?
See:
http://waswatching.com/2008/10/01/who-else-in-place-of-cashman/
You guys want to read more scathing editorial about Cashman. Oops, Yankees Republic did it again. LOL. Man, that guy reams Cashman… Again.
http://theyankeesrepublic.blogspot.com/
Get a GM who knows how to find good pitching.
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Like Wang? Clemens? Wells? Mussina? Joba?
Lookit; the key word in free agent is “free”, as in “free will”, not as in, “costs nuthin’ to buy”.
If Burnett wants 5 years, and the Yanks decide (almost certainly correctly) that 5 years for Burnett is too great a risk at the salary projected, then he is FREE to sign with a team desperate enough to give him 5 years.
If Lowe would rather play for the Red Sox, he is FREE to do so. Cashman must decide if he wants to overwhelm him to get him to sign, and risk extra money or extra years. Lowe is STILL FREE not to accept.
If Sabathia is willing to give up tens of millions of dollars to play closer to home, he is FREE to do so.
Cashman cannot compel any of these pitchers to accept Yanks’ greenbacks, and this is no reflection on his ability as a general manager. In fact, I think these three pitchers would be smart to follow their hearts, and sign where they think they’d be most comfortable.
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Half the time, I sit here HOPING the Yanks can’t sign any good free agent pitchers, because in order for the Yankees to be truly competitive with the well-run Rays and Red Sox organizations, (not to mention the Orioles improving their own system by leaps and bounds, and the Riccardi-run Jays always lurking as a background threat) they have to develop some of their own young pitching. Have to. Have to.
This evil side of me wants Yankees fans to watch Hughes and Kennedy go out there every 5th day and be forced to sit and squirm and wait for them to develop into major league starters.
The Yankees simply can no longer afford to be the only team in baseball whose prospects must make it big from day one. They have to have a few roster spots available for young players to develop into, because, with the formerly steroided older players no longer able to indefinitely extend their better living through chemistry anymore, the future will increasingly belong to the young.
I don’t give a hoot if people think Hughes and Kennedy will never amount to anything. Maybe they never will; the Yanks still have to try. Because if they don’t get off the eternal treadmill of aging ballplayers and other teams’s injury risks, they won’t win anything, or even be very competitive, for a decade.
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And then I remember how awful it was from 1989-1992, and I have second thoughts.
In the meantime, if they lose out on Sabathia, Lowe, and Burnett, and have to settle for Garland and Perez, or whoever, that might be Cashman’s fault.
But it probably won’t be.
One last thing: Jake Peavy’s pretty darn good, but he ain’t Santana.
You’re all being a bit overzealous in your criticism of Steve, here. He makes a good point. Say the Yanks don’t sign 2 of the top FA pitchers and fail to land another starter via trade. So, in order to make up for the loss in defense, they’ll just pile on the offense (that hasn’t worked for years)? Isn’t that just dumb? Won’t that handicap them from future endeavors in the pitching department? At the end of the day, the team needs to be a well rounded one, not just an offensive juggernaut.
they’ll just pile on the offense (that hasn’t worked for years)?
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Define “hasn’t worked for years.”
From ’96 on, the Yanks had a top 5 offense every year except 96 & 00.
So if no free agent starting pitchers want to sign with the Yankees, then Cashman wants to improve the team in other ways? OH NO! WHAT A TERRIBLE THING!
It’s called GM-ing 101. Hedge your bets.
FWIW, the championship Yankees starting pitching was almost never tops in the league. In ’96, their rotation was very average. Same in ’99, and in 2000, their pitching was borderline terrible. The only championship team that had certifiably great pitching was the ’98 team, and that is arguably the best team ever.
1) It’s Cashman 101: Can’t come up with pitchers; so, add hitters.
2) Get a GM who knows how to find good pitching.
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1) First, I’d like to point out that you’re complaining based on the statements of a “baseball official.” Which one, we don’t know. For all we know, it’s George King of the NY Post himself.
But even supposing for a moment that the venerable Mr. King actually HAD developed a single credible source in his life, potentially adding Teixeira (a Boras client) would be a BAD thing? In light of how the offense regressed last year? In light of the fact that it doesn’t project to be any better this year?
I know that goes against your “pray for Jeter and Posada” to bounce back strategem but I am scratching my head trying to figure out why adding a 28 year old switch-hitting slugger in his prime who also happens to play plus defense at a position that has been woefully undermanned since 2003 would be a bad course of action. Career .290/.378/.541…for shame! He’s probably just a stat-padder.
2) Even if the GM is, as you allege, a complete shit-for-brains in the pitching talent evaluation process, I don’t see why your comment is relevant. If you’re upset that Cashman is talking to hitters right now because it’s evidence that he’s not focusing on the correct areas of team improvement, then what would his evalation skills have to do with anything here? He wants CC Sabathia and has made him a generous offer. You don’t want Sabathia because he’s overweight and has logged a lot of innings over the past two seasons. The other free agent options among pitchers are guys with injury issues (Sheets, Burnett). So if the market is frought with risk among pitchers, why would Cashman NOT look at hitters as a remedy?
What could a better evaluator of pitching talent do in this market? It’s not up for debate that Sabathia and Sheets represent the best of the market, warts and all. So whether the GM is competent or incompetent and building a good pitching staff, he’d still be picking among those two first.
Is there some pitcher out there on the market that you think a good evaluator of pitching talent would immediately spot that Cashman is missing?
You guys want to read more scathing editorial about Cashman. Oops, Yankees Republic did it again. LOL. Man, that guy reams Cashman… Again.
http://theyankeesrepublic.blogspot.com/
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The guy makes some points but isn’t 100% correct.
He’s criticizing Cashman for not trading for Santana last year and trusting the kids and then claiming that offering Sabathia a contract is a reactionary move since it will now relegate the kids to AAA. Some would actually say that Cashman is perfectly reasonable to do this. Assuming Sabathia signs, he gets the pitcher and keeps the kids all at roughly the same cost. Seems logical enough to me.
He also says that the difference between Minnesota and the Yanks in 2008 was that their rookie rotation didn’t pitch with the weight of expectations. That’s preposterous. Yes, a lot was expected of Hughes/Kennedy, especially when viewed as the opportunity cost for not acquiring Santana. But the rookies in Minnesota obviously had expectations on them, namely to succeed at the big league level over the course of a 162-game season. If they flopped, they’d end up in the minors. I refuse to believe that those kids didn’t feel pressure, knowing that they were the only thing standing between the Twins having a good or bad season. It’s a very New York-centric point of view to believe that pressure doesn’t exist in other places.
It’s a very New York-centric point of view to believe that pressure doesn’t exist in other places.
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When did that bs start, anyway?
Evan, I agree with your point. Toronto has kids like Cecil and Romero in their minor league system that can come in and help and have a surplus of relief pitchers that can be stretched out to become starters. Do the Yankees have anyone that can help startingwise now? Kennedy or Hughes? NO way… The Os will be better, Tampa will add Price into the mix and Boston will still be good so they have their work cut out for them.
The CCmess isn’t finished yet. That idiot Sabean offering CC a contract would be complete stupidity. The Giants need to hit , they have a ton of pitching ,why would you have HALF of your payroll in two pitchers and the team STILL can’t hit. I can’t see CC going to Frisco no matter how hard he wants to go there.He might become Zito Part Deux……
In addition, what Yankee fan really wants Burnett? Separated from the only pitching coach he has ever known(Arnsberg) , his buddy Halladay and being in NYC Lite(though the Toronto guys like Wilner rip him a new asshole every now and then) Burnett will either flop in NYC or get injured very quickly. I don’t care if the Yankees overpay for CC OR Lowe, just don’t bring AJ here. I don’t care if he stays in Toronto as a Yankee killer either, I don’t want 3.5 years of AJ on the DL and the Yankee shills turning on him like white on rice.
As for Teixeira, the Yanks need to shore up their offense more than anything. Manny is a last resort BECAUSE of the circus that Manny brings to the game. I like Manny on Toronto because he fits on that team (they need a recless DH type that can hit like Bradley or Manny) ,on the Yanks he will make the Bronx Zoo look like a Romper Room episode! I can see Kay rip Manny for his sloppy appearance every game. That being said, they need to replace Giambi and Abreu’s numbers or this team is battling for fourth.
When did that bs start, anyway?
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I have no clue but I think it’s directly tied to the media and is a ploy to appeal to fans’ sense of self. If the New York or Boston tabloids don’t prop themselves up as being “the toughest” or the “most discerning” then, by extension, their readers aren’t those things either. We WANT to feel like we’re smarter than fans in Cleveland and we WANT to feel like playing for the Yankees is harder, thus the reward is greater.
It’s all a bunch of nonsense. A certain segment of the population will continue to believe it as long as Lupica and Shaughnessy and Sherman continue to pimp that stupid idea. But I also like to think that people are getting smarter as a result of blogs and sports think-tanks like Baseball Think Factory and can begin to look past this idea.
We WANT to feel like we’re smarter than fans in Cleveland
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That’s because we are… lol
It appears the days of Cleveland being a punchline are long gone.
I will say this: I went to college in St. Louis and attended a boatload of Cardinals games when I lived out there from 1993-1999. Their mindless love-fest is silly and unsophisticated but no moreso than the New York/Boston attitude that no pressure exists elsewhere and that fans in these markets are “smarter” or “better.”
MJ, I remember Tino remarking at how tolerant they were when he was replacing Mark “Steroid -AndroMan” McGuire. Compare that to when he took over from Donny BallGame, big difference. Some people like Schill or Tino like to be in the Northeast where the fans care whereas others want the lack of limelight.
Fans are smarter in Philly, NYC or Boston? They might be more vocal, vicious, and louder but not that smart. Go to a Philly game when they play the Mets and see what I mean and see how passionate Northeast fans can be!
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