• Yanks Not Interested In Rafael Soriano?

    Posted by on January 7th, 2011 · Comments (15)

    So tweets Buster -

    Soriano would have to make himself absurdly cheap — on a very short-term (1-year or 2-year deal) — before NYY would even consider him.

    Perhaps the Yankees are looking at Michael Wuertz’ 2010 season, or, looking at J.J. Putz’ 2008 season and thinking “not worth the long term commitment and the dollars”? And, if they are, I would totally understand why…

    Pitcher                       YEAR   BR/9 IP    RSAA       G       GS
    1    Joaquin Benoit           2010     6.12       16       63        0
    2    J.J. Putz                2007     6.53       24       68        0
    3    Rafael Soriano           2010     7.36       14       64        0
    4    Michael Wuertz           2009     8.58       15       74        0

    stats via Complete Baseball Encyclopedia.

    Filter: 2007-2010, RHP, AGE = 30, RSAA >= 12, GAMES >= 60, GAMES STARTED = 0 and BASERUNNERS/9 IP < 9

    Comments on Yanks Not Interested In Rafael Soriano?

    1. MJ Recanati
      January 7th, 2011 | 9:29 am

      Unless Soriano is signing for 2Y/$10M — and I’m sure he’s not — I really don’t have an interest in him. Irrational as it may be, I’d rather have two picks in the top 55 in this year’s draft. Losing the #31 overall pick for a reliever isn’t the worst trade-off in the world but since the way compensation picks and the amateur draft work will likely be revamped during the next labor negotiation (2012), this could be the Yankees’ last chance to maximize their financial power in the June draft under the current rules.

    2. jrk
      January 7th, 2011 | 9:40 am

      @ MJ Recanati:
      Do you suggest the Yankees sign any relievers? Or just go with what they have? I’m just hesitant about the current players, especially assuming Joba or Robertson can handle the 8th. I like Robertson overall, but I don’t think he is consistent enough for that role yet. And Joba, well, I don’t know how anyone could have confidence in him manning the 8th inning role.

    3. MJ Recanati
      January 7th, 2011 | 10:12 am

      @ jrk:
      Based on last year, yes, we have a right to be a bit concerned about Robertson/Joba in their bullpen roles. As a result, I don’t mind adding depth to the bullpen because one of the keys to a successful bullpen is having multiple pieces that you can move around.

      For that reason, I’m fine with the Yankees inviting a bunch of arms to spring training, working the waiver wire, making low-cost/high-upside signings, etc. But in terms of front-end bullpen help, I don’t think the financial commitment ends up being worth it in the long run. As such, I don’t think there’s any guarantee that Rafael Soriano will be good in 2012 or 2013 to justify giving him the three or four year deal that the market dictates he should receive. I’d gamble on a two-year deal but I can’t see him settling for that. Thus, in the case of Soriano, I just don’t see it working out.

    4. jrk
      January 7th, 2011 | 11:21 am

      @ MJ Recanati:
      Fair enough. I understand your assessment, but I think I’d roll the dice on three years, but who knows if he is even amenable to that. However, like you pointed out, there is always the risk that it could be the next Kyle Farnsworth deal.

    5. LMJ229
      January 7th, 2011 | 12:06 pm

      With the question marks in our starting rotation, and seemingly no help in sight, it would be best to develop a shut-down bullpen if possible. We do not have that right now in Joba and Robertson. I think Soriano would be worth the risk of a three year deal as long as the price tag is reasonable.

    6. Evan3457
      January 7th, 2011 | 12:18 pm

      If it was up to me, I’d take a serious run at Jon Rauch.

      He’s not as good as Soriano when Soriano’s healthy, but:

      1. He has some closing experience, just in case.
      2. He’s reasonably durable, only 1 injury the last few years.
      3. He did OK in the AL last year.
      4. He can pitch 1+ innings when he needs to.
      5. There’s no Boras factor.
      6. There’s no Boras factor, so he won’t be anywhere near as expensive as Soriano.
      7. He won’t cost a draft pick.

      The only drawback I can reasonably see here is Rauch vs. lefties at the Stadium.

    7. BOHAN
      January 7th, 2011 | 12:33 pm

      @ Evan3457:
      i like that idea… i forgot he was still on the market

    8. MJ Recanati
      January 7th, 2011 | 12:38 pm

      LMJ229 wrote:

      I think Soriano would be worth the risk of a three year deal as long as the price tag is reasonable.

      The last part of your comment says it all. Why would we expect that Soriano would be signed to a reasonable deal? By all accounts, he can be a closer on most teams in baseball. As such, he’s entitled to earn around $8-10M per season. I can’t see him signing for less than $7M/season and, frankly, that’s an unreasonable cost for the Yankees to be paying a setup man, especially for three seasons.

      @ Evan3457:
      I’d have no problem with Rauch on a 1Y/$4M or 2Y/$8M like with Feliciano. Unlike Soriano, Rauch probably isn’t competing for the 9th inning role.

    9. jrk
      January 7th, 2011 | 2:17 pm

      UPDATE: http://yankees.lhblogs.com/2011/01/07/cashman-i-will-not-lose-our-no-1-draft-pick/

      Cashman basically saying no thanks to Soriano b/c of the same concern MJ had – losing draft pick. Obviously he could change his mind, but seems very unlikely.

    10. MJ Recanati
      January 7th, 2011 | 2:26 pm

      @ jrk:
      I agree with Cashman. For Cliff Lee (or Carl Crawford), losing a first-round draft pick is a no-brainer. For a relief pitcher? Not nearly as good an idea.

    11. January 7th, 2011 | 9:21 pm

      The Yankees closer is 41 years old. 41. At some point even the great Mariano, the greatest relief pitcher of all time, might start looking human. 42 year old Trevor Hoffman didn’t have it anymore. Dennis Eckersley at 38 started going downhill. I don’t know, it might be nice to have a plan B should Mariano start to decline. In all meaningful ways the Yankees are worse off now than at the end of last year when they staggered to the playoffs only to be crushed in the second round by the 90 win Texas Rangers.

      Anyone who thinks this can be fixed during the season is dreaming, this time the cost of Cashman’s bungling may well be a team that is out of it by the end of July. Draft choices won’t help fill empty stadium seats, empty stadium restaurants and southward bound YES rating. The hole that’s being dug here may take years to get out of.

    12. Evan3457
      January 7th, 2011 | 11:39 pm

      There’s no hole being dug.

      The only loss from last season is Pettitte, who was missing almost the entire second half last year anyway.

      Exactly what has Cashman bungled here? Lee didn’t want to come to NY? Too bad for the Yankees, and too bad for us. The Brewers didn’t have a plan B for Hoffman; nevertheless, Axford popped right up in the role, and did quite well. Let’s not pretend that anyone who follows Mariano will be as good. In addition, you don’t spend $12 million a year to back up a $15 million a year closer.

      What is to be “fixed”? The Yanks need one decent starter, and one decent set-up type reliever. That can’t be done in season? The hell it can’t.

    13. January 8th, 2011 | 1:04 pm

      @ Evan3457:

      “The only loss from last season was Petitte”. OK, why isn’t that a problem. He won 11 games and hasn’t been replaced in any way, shape or form.

      The Lee thing was bungled. First, and I said this at the time, the Yanks never should have allowed him time to shop the offer. Lee wasn’t in a position to shop the offer. The nerve of this prick. This isn’t Sandy Koufax in his prime, or Roy Halladay for that matter. You tell his agent he has 24 hours to accept the offer or not. He doesn’t, you call a press conference and announce the Yanks are out of the bidding. You don’t sit on your hands, you then go after Crawford. Rather than making things happen, Cashman let things happen.

      “You don’t spend $12 million a year to back up a $15 million a year closer” , says who, is that in the Bible or something. Back in 77 the Yankees closer won the Cy Young award, that winter the Yankees went out and signed the best closer in the National League, Goose Gossage. I think that overindulgence worked out, don’t you These are the Yankees, they play by different rules. Mariano is 41 years old, get real here, a good GM anticipates needs, that’s not happening here. As far as Milwaukee is concerned, sorry, I don’t see the Brewers as the organization that sets the standard I want to follow.

      I think the Yankees have real issues here. Hughes might be a good third starter (and that’s fine)he hasn’t convinced me he’s more than that. AJ outside of the 18 win walk year is really a 12 or 13 game winner, maybe we have to start accepting that. Nova didn’t show much and Mitre well … .

      If things break the wrong way this team could fall to .500 this season. I think we all should be prepared for that.

    14. Raf
      January 8th, 2011 | 2:49 pm

      Joseph Maloney wrote:

      The Lee thing was bungled. First, and I said this at the time, the Yanks never should have allowed him time to shop the offer. Lee wasn’t in a position to shop the offer. The nerve of this prick. This isn’t Sandy Koufax in his prime, or Roy Halladay for that matter. You tell his agent he has 24 hours to accept the offer or not. He doesn’t, you call a press conference and announce the Yanks are out of the bidding. You don’t sit on your hands, you then go after Crawford. Rather than making things happen, Cashman let things happen.

      Really? C’mon now. Setting ultimatums solve nothing, assembling a press conference accomplishes nothing. There was nothing stopping Cashman from making a bid on Crawford, if he so desired. I would hope the GM gig entails a little bit more than waiting around the phone hoping an agent would call, or calling the same agent every 5 minutes to see if the player is representing has changed his mind.

      As far as Milwaukee is concerned, sorry, I don’t see the Brewers as the organization that sets the standard I want to follow.

      You missed the point, which was that if something happens to Rivera, someone else gets pushed into the role. Maybe it’s Joba, maybe it’s Hughes, maybe it’s someone who is acquired in a trade, maybe it’s someone from the farm.

    15. Evan3457
      January 8th, 2011 | 3:14 pm

      Joseph Maloney wrote:

      @ Evan3457:
      “The only loss from last season was Petitte”. OK, why isn’t that a problem. He won 11 games and hasn’t been replaced in any way, shape or form.

      …and he was very unlikely to pitch as well again this year, given that last year was his best year since he was on the Astros, and he’s 38 years old, 39 in June.

      The Lee thing was bungled. First, and I said this at the time, the Yanks never should have allowed him time to shop the offer. Lee wasn’t in a position to shop the offer. The nerve of this prick. This isn’t Sandy Koufax in his prime, or Roy Halladay for that matter.
      So let me get this straight. Pettitte is irreplaceable, but Lee’s nobody special. Uh-huh.

      You tell his agent he has 24 hours to accept the offer or not. He doesn’t, you call a press conference and announce the Yanks are out of the bidding.

      All that does is make sure you don’t get the one player you want.

      You don’t sit on your hands, you then go after Crawford.

      Cashman has NO intention of spending $140 million on Crawford.

      Rather than making things happen, Cashman let things happen.

      Better nothing happens, then stupid things, wasteful things, happen.

      “You don’t spend $12 million a year to back up a $15 million a year closer” , says who,

      Says anyone who can properly evaluate how much relief pitching is worth. With the signings of Jenks and Wheeler, the Red Sox are now spending
      less than that on their entire 5-man core relief staff. Interesting, isn’t it?

      Back in 77 the Yankees closer won the Cy Young award, that winter the Yankees went out and signed the best closer in the National League, Goose Gossage. I think that overindulgence worked out, don’t you?

      Actually, that was another Boss George overkill move which basically ended Sparkly Lyle’s career as a useful Yankee. He was significantly less effective in 1978, and, as his wild-man free-spirit act didn’t play well with the Boss, he was traded by the end of that year, the moment he less than awesome on the field. Fortunately for the Yanks, the incompetent Rangers threw Dave Righetti into the deal, so it wasn’t a total disaster.

      These are the Yankees, they play by different rules.

      Well, no, not really. They are still operating, whether we like it or not, under Hal’s season opening payroll cap, to avoid paying more payroll tax.

      Mariano is 41 years old, get real here, a good GM anticipates needs, that’s not happening here.

      And he was 40 last year, and 39 the year before that, and 38 the year before that. Why is signing a back-up closer to a ridiculous amount GOOD strategy only now? Why wasn’t it good strategy in 2008? 2009? 2010?

      The answer is, it isn’t.

      As far as Milwaukee is concerned, sorry, I don’t see the Brewers as the organization that sets the standard I want to follow.

      Not the point. YOU cited Hoffman as the example. My point about Axford is that a well-run organization always has an arm ready it can use to close games, at least in the short term. Nobody who follows Mariano will be Mariano.

      Paying Soriano $36 million over 3 years is a horrible mis-allocation of team payroll which will be needed to pay for whatever top starter comes on the market in mid-season, or at the end of the season.

      I think the Yankees have real issues here. Hughes might be a good third starter (and that’s fine)he hasn’t convinced me he’s more than that. AJ outside of the 18 win walk year is really a 12 or 13 game winner, maybe we have to start accepting that. Nova didn’t show much and Mitre well … .

      That’s right. This team does have real issues. And buying Soriano spends a lot of payroll in not seriously addressing them.

      If things break the wrong way this team could fall to .500 this season. I think we all should be prepared for that.

      And if things break the right way just as hard, they could win 95-100 games, and be right back in the World Series. I think we should “prepare” just as hard for that.

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