Phil Hughes, Slowey He Turns, Step By Step…
Posted by Steve L. on May 2nd, 2012 · Comments (16)
A case could be made that Phil Hughes’ big league career, to date, has mirrored the start that Kevin Slowey had to his:
| Rk | Player | WAR | GS | IP | From | To | Age | G | W | L | BB | SO | HR | BF | ||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | Phil Hughes | 4.6 | 76 | 96 | 465.1 | 2007 | 2012 | 21-26 | 125 | 37 | 27 | 164 | 393 | 4.60 | 60 | 1982 |
| 2 | Kevin Slowey | 4.3 | 82 | 95 | 473.1 | 2007 | 2010 | 23-26 | 86 | 39 | 21 | 79 | 361 | 4.41 | 74 | 2006 |
.
Maybe the next time R.A. Dickey climbs a mountain, he can bring Hughes with him? Or, maybe the next time Brian Cashman rappels down a building, he can bring Hughes?
In any event, doesn’t it just seem like yesterday that all we heard about Hughes was how he was in the best shape of his life, had regained his form, and was pitching like an ace in Spring Training? That turned-around not so “slowey,” didn’t it?
Hughes isn’t a starter, plain and simple.
I’m convinced that the minor league coaching staff screwed him up but whether or not that’s true is ultimately irrelevant. Bottom line, Hughes is a reliever and he’ll be good in that role. It’s time to make the move once and for all.
I’m not even sure he would be good as a RP at this point. Yes, he was somewhat good at it in the past – but, that was a small sample size and years ago.
He needs to throw harder – which he doesn’t seem to be able to do – or have razor sharp control/command. Of course, there’s also the issue of him being a two-pitch pitcher.
Amazingly, when Nova got sent down, he came back with a killer slider (that he did not seem to have before). Why someone cannot teach Hughes a slider or an effective change, is beyond me. Unless, the problem is Hughes…?
Bottom line, the Yankees are screwed with him now. You cannot trade him because his value is WAY DOWN. You cannot send him to the minors because he’s already proven that he has enough to fool batters in the bushes…as he has in the past.
Maybe Hughes is just another one of these cases – like Jimmy Haynes, IIRC- who pitch like Greg Maddux in the minors and like Charles Hudson in the majors?
I suppose you can stick him in the pen and see what happens. Perhaps his velo would go up? I just wouldn’t trust him in high leverage spots until you see him able to handle it.
And to think we could of had Johan for this guy…..
Steve L. wrote:
I don’t agree that either of these things are important parts of being a relief pitcher. First, we know that he can dial up the velocity in one-inning stints. Second, command and control are more important to starters than to relievers. Third, and most importantly, being a two-pitch pitcher as a reliever is a luxury, not a handicap.
Steve L. wrote:
We’ve already seen his velocity play up in the bullpen in 2009 and we’ve already seen him handle high-leverage situations in a relief role. Certainly with the bullpen pecking order the way it is, Hughes wouldn’t be called upon to pitch very many high-leverage spots since those situations belong to Rivera and Robertson and, increasingly, Soriano. But bullpens are dynamic things and roles change as performance warrants it. If Hughes were a dominant relief pitcher for a few outings then his leveraged situations would increase accordingly.
For now, the Yankees can’t demote Hughes to the bullpen until Andy Pettitte returns (and proves that he’s still a viable MLB pitcher). But, assuming that Pettitte is still competent, Hughes’s spot in the rotation should be taken from him and he should be returned to the bullpen where his lack of effective secondary stuff won’t hinder him.
@ ken:
I feel the Yanks not trading him (and/or Joba) for someone like Halladay is more disconcerting than not trading him for Johan.
ken wrote:
Oh puh-leaze! You think the Mets feel like they’ve gotten good value for the 6Y/$137.5M contract they signed with him?
Seriously, it was five years ago already. Get over it. The Yanks picked Sabathia over Santana and they’ve been more than proven right in their decision.
I’ll say it again: Calendar and sample size.
Just because Hughes did well as a RP for a limited time 3 years ago, doesn’t mean that he can do it now.
See: Joba, 2007. He’s was never able to match that again.
MJ Recanati wrote:
The Yankees need and want him to be a starter so I really don’t see that changing.
@ Steve L.:
As much as I detest Chamberlain, your statement is simply not factual. Chamberlain’s 2007 success as a reliever is a far greater example of small sample size than his work as a reliever in 2010 and 2011.
Steve L. wrote:
There’s very little in the way of logic backing up your statement. Relief pitching is much easier than starting pitching, which is why so many failed starters end up in the bullpen. Heck, the entire Padres bullpen under Kevin Towers was gleaned from failed starters whose repertoires would play up in a relief role.
I’m not following why Hughes’s success as a reliever in 3/4th’s of a season in 2009, together with the fact that he possesses a plus fastball, would make you think that he wouldn’t be able to transition to relief.
The only people that suck as relievers AND suck as starters are the people that don’t belong in baseball. There’s absolutely nothing to suggest that Hughes doesn’t belong in the game, it’s just that he doesn’t belong in the rotation.
Minor league time, let him ride the bus and till his head or his ass catches on. As a starter. He’s too soft mentally with this BS ass-kissing that he’s used to getting. Enough is enough.
KPOcala wrote:
That is not possible as he has no more minor league options remaining. Any demotion to the minors would require both his consent and his exposure to waivers. Since there’s no doubt another team would put in a waiver claim, the Yankees aren’t going simply let Hughes get picked up by someone else.
KPOcala wrote:
You can’t make a claim like that with no proof. How do you know he’s not the toughest SOB on earth that simply has a problem developing a viable secondary pitch? Let’s not make absurd claims we can’t prove, especially when we can readily see what the major problem with Hughes as a starter is.
FWIW, I have heard from a source who is very close with a star player on the Yankees, in the past, that part of the problem with Hughes and Joba, in the eyes of the players and management, is that they were put on a star pedestal by the media/fans/etc. too soon and it went to their heads – not willing to put the work in, etc.
I think seeing how Hughes allowed him to come into camp last year, coming off his “All-Star” season, backs this up a bit. And, we know that Joba thinks he walks on water.
@ Steve L.:
Even if all that is true, it is still the opinion of the so-called “star player” and not necessarily fact.
More to the point, after Hughes’s humbling 2011 season, he came to camp in shape, etc. and is still struggling. So we can now rule out that it’s a sense of entitlement, a lack of mental toughness or a lack of work ethic that is leading to his struggles.
Whatever his teammates might want to think the problem is, intelligent people are able to see past that noise. Hughes lacks a secondary pitch. Even the most dedicated and down-to-earth pitcher can’t overcome that shortcoming in the rotation (just ask Mariano Rivera).
MJ Recanati wrote:
And 3rd hand information at that.
Raf wrote:
That too.