• Joba On The Block?

    Posted by on March 13th, 2013 · Comments (28)

    Via George King

    Sensing the Yankees might have bullpen depth, the Rangers are following Joba Chamberlain.

    Don Welke, a senior special assistant to Texas general manager Jon Daniels, was at Steinbrenner Field on Monday specifically to watch Chamberlain pitch an inning against St. Louis.

    Chamberlain gave up a hit but not a run. Nor did he walk or strike out a batter. His fastball was clocked at 92-95 mph.

    In five spring outings, Chamberlain has thrown five innings, given up four hits, walked two and whiffed three.

    The only poor outing came March 1 against the Phillies at home when Chamberlain gave up two runs, two hits and walked two. It was his first appearance since Feb. 26, when after a scoreless inning in Clearwater in which he allowed a hit and fanned two, Chamberlain talked openly about being a starter or closer.

    Manager Joe Girardi and general manager Brian Cashman were not thrilled when they heard those remarks.

    A healthy Chamberlain would deepen the Yankees’ bullpen, but they have options in David Aardsma and Shawn Kelley to use in front of setup man David Robertson.

    I cannot imagine that the Rangers would make the trip if they didn’t already talk to the Yankees about Chamberlain being available. I just hope this is not a swap for Nelson Cruz.

    Comments on Joba On The Block?

    1. Raf
      March 13th, 2013 | 5:11 pm

      I hope wherever Joba lands, he starts.

    2. Evan3457
      March 13th, 2013 | 6:42 pm

      Raf wrote:

      I hope wherever Joba lands, he starts.

      Yeah, now that his elbow is repaired, if he wants to try it again, he should go somewhere where he they’ll let him try.

      Now, if Joba should go elsewhere and if they should let hims start again, and he succeeds, is it…

      a) a drafting success for the Yankees talent scouts and Cashman, or

      b) a developmental failure for the Yankees development people and Cashman?

      Many here will say b), but the correct answer will be: both.

    3. Ricketson
      March 13th, 2013 | 7:00 pm

      Evan3457 wrote:

      Now, if Joba should go elsewhere and if they should let hims start again, and he succeeds, is it…

      a. – a drafting sucess; Chamberlain won’t succeed as a starter; and Cashman won’t get adequate value in a trade.

    4. March 13th, 2013 | 7:26 pm

      Bullpen depth, what bullpen depth? Soriano is gone, Mo is 43 years old and coming off a major injury, am I missing something here. On the starter side we have Andy who spent most of last year on the DL, and Phil Hughes who has yet to throw a pitch. How can the Yankees even think about trading a pitcher?

    5. Raf
      March 13th, 2013 | 10:31 pm

      Joseph Maloney wrote:

      Bullpen depth, what bullpen depth?

      Rivera, Aardsma, Robertson, Logan, Eppley, Rapada, Kelley, loser of the Phelps/Nova battle & Chamberlain.

    6. Evan3457
      March 14th, 2013 | 12:01 am

      Ricketson wrote:

      Evan3457 wrote:
      Now, if Joba should go elsewhere and if they should let hims start again, and he succeeds, is it…
      a. – a drafting sucess; Chamberlain won’t succeed as a starter; and Cashman won’t get adequate value in a trade.

      I was thinking that Joba would go somewhere as a free agent next year, even if the Yanks don’t trade him.

      As for Joba’s value, it is potential value. Teams won’t give up much for potential value, several years “post-hype”. There is no reason, right now, to believe that he’ll become a top starter. Thus there is no way to
      “get adequate value” in the event that he gets traded and then succeeds as a starter elsewhere, as the Yanks would be, in hindsight, selling low.

    7. MJ Recanati
      March 14th, 2013 | 8:42 am

      Evan3457 wrote:

      the Yanks would be, in hindsight, selling low.

      Better than losing him for nothing (since wouldn’t warrant a tender offer).

      Anything the Yankees can get for Joba Chamberlain is worth it since it’s clear that he won’t be back netx year.

    8. MJ Recanati
      March 14th, 2013 | 8:43 am

      Evan3457 wrote:

      Now, if Joba should go elsewhere and if they should let hims start again, and he succeeds, is it:

      a) a drafting success for the Yankees talent scouts and Cashman, or

      b) a developmental failure for the Yankees development people and Cashman?

      Many here will say b), but the correct answer will be: both.

      Mucb more “b” than “a” but I agree that it would be both.

    9. MJ Recanati
      March 14th, 2013 | 8:43 am

      MJ Recanati wrote:

      Mucb

      *Much

    10. MJ Recanati
      March 14th, 2013 | 8:49 am

      Joseph Maloney wrote:

      How can the Yankees even think about trading a pitcher?

      Chamberlain isn’t considered a starter on this team so he doesn’t count as depth for the starting rotation. As such, he’s just an arm in the bullpen and those guys are, for the most part, fungible.

    11. MJ Recanati
      March 14th, 2013 | 8:53 am

      Steve L. wrote:

      I just hope this is not a swap for Nelson Cruz.

      Why not? He’s a free agent after this year, as Chamberlain is. Cruz can play LF and would be a solid LF/DH type for a team that needs another bat this season.

      I doubt that’s what the Rangers would offer — they need Cruz more now that Hamilton is gone — but I think Cruz could find a role on this team.

    12. March 14th, 2013 | 10:18 am

      MJ Recanati wrote:

      Why not? He’s a free agent after this year, as Chamberlain is. Cruz can play LF and would be a solid LF/DH type for a team that needs another bat this season.

      I doubt that’s what the Rangers would offer — they need Cruz more now that Hamilton is gone — but I think Cruz could find a role on this team.

      My fear – that he gets suspended for 50 games this year. Why trade for a player if you are only going to get him for less than 100 games and then have him walk.

    13. MJ Recanati
      March 14th, 2013 | 1:23 pm

      Steve L. wrote:

      My fear – that he gets suspended for 50 games this year. Why trade for a player if you are only going to get him for less than 100 games and then have him walk.

      That’s a fear that may be realized for every player in the majors, I’m afraid to tell you.

    14. March 14th, 2013 | 1:24 pm

      @ MJ Recanati:
      More so on Cruz now thanks to the New Times report.

    15. MJ Recanati
      March 14th, 2013 | 2:49 pm

      Steve L. wrote:

      More so on Cruz now thanks to the New Times report.

      Nah. Cruz hasn’t failed a test so it’s unlikely — not impossible, but unlikely — that Cruz or any other person associated with the Bosch clinic will be disciplined without further evidence.

    16. March 14th, 2013 | 8:57 pm

      Raf wrote:

      Joseph Maloney wrote:Bullpen depth, what bullpen depth?Rivera, Aardsma, Robertson, Logan, Eppley, Rapada, Kelley, loser of the Phelps/Nova battle & Chamberlain.

      Sorry Raf, I don’t see it in that list. Bodies don’t necessarily translate into depth. Mariano is 43, and coming off a big injury, who knows how he will pitch. Robertson and Phelps Chamberlain are the high leverage guys after Mo. The rest of the pen is little more than speculation.

      The Phelps/Nova battle has turned into a fight for the 4th and 5th starter slots.

    17. March 14th, 2013 | 9:06 pm

      MJ Recanati wrote:

      Joseph Maloney wrote:How can the Yankees even think about trading a pitcher?Chamberlain isn’t considered a starter on this team so he doesn’t count as depth for the starting rotation. As such, he’s just an arm in the bullpen and those guys are, for the most part, fungible.</blockquote

      We don't know what to expect from Mo, Andy made 12 starts last year, and Hughes has back problems, don't look now but Phelps and Nova should get plenty of work, as starters. In all liklihood this bullpen will be heavily taxed.

    18. Raf
      March 14th, 2013 | 9:25 pm

      Joseph Maloney wrote:

      Sorry Raf, I don’t see it in that list. Bodies don’t necessarily translate into depth. Mariano is 43, and coming off a big injury, who knows how he will pitch. Robertson and Phelps Chamberlain are the high leverage guys after Mo. The rest of the pen is little more than speculation.

      The Phelps/Nova battle has turned into a fight for the 4th and 5th starter slots.

      Of course you don’t see it. You refuse to see it. :P

      I’m used to the pessimism around here ;)
      http://waswatching.com/2011/04/29/the-bartolo-colon-freddy-garcia-pipe-dream/
      http://waswatching.com/2011/05/21/colon-garcia/

      Bullpen arms are a dime a dozen, if these guys don’t do the job, someone else will get swapped in that will. Been that way since the modern bullpen was established.

      Rotation’s CC-Kuroda-Pettitte-Hughes-Nova/Phelps. The loser of the 5th starter battle will probably find themselves in the bullpen.

    19. MJ Recanati
      March 15th, 2013 | 12:20 pm

      Joseph Maloney wrote:

      We don’t know what to expect from Mo, Andy made 12 starts last year, and Hughes has back problems, don’t look now but Phelps and Nova should get plenty of work, as starters. In all liklihood this bullpen will be heavily taxed.

      Andy made 12 starts last year because a batted ball broke his ankle. That’s called a freak injury; nothing is structurally wrong with his shoulder or elbow. We don’t know what to expect of Rivera but, as with Pettitte, he suffered a freak injury that doesn’t affect his shoulder or elbow. One of Nova or Phelps is slated for the bullpen, with the other in the rotation. If something further happens to Hughes then the loser of the Nova/Phelps battle will take Hughes’s spot in the rotation.

      Again, I’m not seeing where Joba fits in here in your fears about the rotation. If starters don’t perform up to the task, the one thing that won’t happen is Chamberlain moving into the rotation. Moreover, if the bullpen needs to pitch more innings to make up for a shortfall in starters’ innings, the extra workload won’t be shifted to the designated short relievers like Chamberlain/Robertson/Rivera. The team will simply call up more long arms/swingmen like Phelps from the minors or seek out help via waivers/trade.

      Your concerns may or may not be well-founded but your belief that Chamberlain plays any role beyond 7th inning guy is misplaced.

    20. March 15th, 2013 | 12:37 pm

      MJ Recanati wrote:

      Andy made 12 starts last year because a batted ball broke his ankle. That’s called a freak injury;

      What about the notion that older people have bones that break more easily?

    21. MJ Recanati
      March 15th, 2013 | 1:00 pm

      Steve L. wrote:

      What about the notion that older people have bones that break more easily?

      What about it? Age isn’t why he broke his bone, the batted ball broke it. It’s not like he just fell over because the bone in his foot gave out.

      Batted balls are a risk of the game but it’s nevertheless a probabilities game as to whether a player will be struck by a batted (or thrown) ball. Pettitte could’ve just as easily not been hit by that ball and made it through the season without injury.

    22. March 15th, 2013 | 1:13 pm

      MJ Recanati wrote:

      What about it?

      If Pettitte gets hit with that same ball when he’s 29, maybe the bone doesn’t break.

    23. March 15th, 2013 | 1:14 pm

      Steve L. wrote:

      If Pettitte gets hit with that same ball when he’s 29, maybe the bone doesn’t break.

      Further, when you rely on a bunch of players in key spots who are on the wrong side of 30, the chances of freak injuries being bad increase.

    24. MJ Recanati
      March 15th, 2013 | 1:23 pm

      Steve L. wrote:

      If Pettitte gets hit with that same ball when he’s 29, maybe the bone doesn’t break.

      Unknowable. There have been plenty of under-29 players who got hurt and missed time due to freak injuries caused by batted balls.

      Steve L. wrote:

      Further, when you rely on a bunch of players in key spots who are on the wrong side of 30, the chances of freak injuries being bad increase.

      The alternative — relying on a bunch of players in key spots who are on the right side of 30 — probably means that the Yankees look more like the Pirates or Royals and would have a lousy shot at making the playoffs.

      The Yankees have been a veteran team for two solid decades. The risks exist for the old team as for the young team. There is no perfectly-built team that can forecast every single permutation of luck out there.

      The other alternative, of course, is for the Yanks to have told Pettitte to take a hike. Would you have preferred that?

    25. March 15th, 2013 | 2:12 pm

      MJ Recanati wrote:

      The other alternative, of course, is for the Yanks to have told Pettitte to take a hike. Would you have preferred that?

      I would prefer for them not to be dependent on guys near 40 (or older) at their key positions.

    26. MJ Recanati
      March 15th, 2013 | 3:27 pm

      Steve L. wrote:

      I would prefer for them not to be dependent on guys near 40 (or older) at their key positions.

      In other words, Pettitte, Jeter and others should be told to pound dirt.

    27. Raf
      March 15th, 2013 | 5:09 pm

      Steve L. wrote:

      MJ Recanati wrote:
      What about it?
      If Pettitte gets hit with that same ball when he’s 29, maybe the bone doesn’t break.

      Jeff Kartsens, 24 during the 2007 season
      http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/yankees/karstens-breaks-leg-article-1.208164

      :P

    28. Raf
      March 15th, 2013 | 5:10 pm

      MJ Recanati wrote:

      The Yankees have been a veteran team for two solid decades.

      Longer than that.

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