• Since July 7th 2013, The Yankees Are 10-18

    Posted by on August 10th, 2013 · Comments (29)

    This includes today’s loss.

    In fact, the Yankees have not won back-to-back games since the All-Star break.

    Why would anyone want to watch this team, any more, they way they are playing?

    At the rate they are going, how long until they are in last place?

    Comments on Since July 7th 2013, The Yankees Are 10-18

    1. KPOcala
      August 10th, 2013 | 9:05 pm

      Hi Hal! Wait’ll next year, at least the average fan can pick up cheap seats behind home plate……………..

    2. KPOcala
      August 10th, 2013 | 9:08 pm

      Funny, how the ’09 World Series teams have spiraled down together. Well, no t funny, but interesting….. And let’s not forget the Angels…

    3. Evan3457
      August 10th, 2013 | 9:27 pm

      KPOcala wrote:

      Funny, how the ’09 World Series teams have spiraled down together. Well, no t funny, but interesting….. And let’s not forget the Angels…

      And for largely the same reasons.
      All while spending large sums of money, which some people believe is a guarantee of pennants and titles.

    4. Evan3457
      August 10th, 2013 | 9:28 pm

      I’ll be going to two more games this. One with nephew #2, and the last home game of the season, hopefully to bid Mariano a rousing good-bye with his last home save.

    5. Ricketson
      August 10th, 2013 | 10:08 pm

      Evan3457 wrote:

      And for largely the same reasons.

      I didn’t know Cashman was the G.M. of the Phillies too. His father knew Bill Giles?
      Evan3457 wrote:

      All while spending large sums of money, which some people believe is a guarantee of pennants and titles.

      Correct. And the Phillies won two pennants, or twice as many as John Cashman’s son from 2005-12, and more than any other N.L. franchise in the 2000-09 decade. Very good, Evan.

    6. Ricketson
      August 10th, 2013 | 10:11 pm

      Ricketson wrote:

      more than any other N.L. franchise in the 2000-09 decade.

      With the exception of St. Louis, which also won 2.

    7. Tuttle
      August 10th, 2013 | 10:38 pm

      Steve L. wrote:

      At the rate they are going, how long until they are in last place?

      At the rate they are going, how long until they are in first place? Aug. 10, 2017?

    8. Evan3457
      August 10th, 2013 | 10:55 pm

      Ricketson wrote:

      Evan3457 wrote:
      And for largely the same reasons.
      I didn’t know Cashman was the G.M. of the Phillies too. His father knew Bill Giles?
      Evan3457 wrote:
      All while spending large sums of money, which some people believe is a guarantee of pennants and titles.
      Correct. And the Phillies won two pennants, or twice as many as John Cashman’s son from 2005-12, and more than any other N.L. franchise in the 2000-09 decade. Very good, Evan.

      It’s amazing the way you think the points you make prove your position, when they actually prove mine…

      Phillies

      2006: 8th in NL in payroll, 2nd in NL East
      2007: 7th in NL in payroll, Division Champs
      2008: 6th in NL in payroll, Won World Series
      2009: 3rd in NL in payroll, Won NL Pennant
      2010: 2nd in NL in payroll, Won Division, lost NLCS
      2011: 1st in NL in payroll, Won Division, lost NLDS
      2012: 1st in NL in payroll, 3rd in NL East
      2013: 2nd in NL in payroll, 4th in NL East

      See the pattern?
      Probably not.

    9. Evan3457
      August 10th, 2013 | 10:58 pm

      Ricketson wrote:

      Evan3457 wrote:
      And for largely the same reasons.
      I didn’t know Cashman was the G.M. of the Phillies too. His father knew Bill Giles?

      Not merely missing the point, but actually making the opposite point.

      Cashman was NOT involved in the Phillies, but the high spending/low output pattern is the same.

    10. August 10th, 2013 | 11:12 pm

      Tuttle wrote:

      At the rate they are going, how long until they are in first place? Aug. 10, 2017?

      Good point

    11. Evan3457
      August 11th, 2013 | 12:17 am

      Tuttle wrote:

      Steve L. wrote:
      At the rate they are going, how long until they are in last place?
      At the rate they are going, how long until they are in first place? Aug. 10, 2017?

      Might be right. Might be longer.

    12. August 11th, 2013 | 12:23 am

      YES rating have been off dramatically this year, can you imagine what the numbers will look like the rest of the way. Can you imagine what the numbers will look like from this point on at the ballpark. There’s so much work to be done here, it could take years before this is fixed. To me the turning point was 2010, going for it that year made sense, but after that young players had to be integrated into an old team. Now, it’s too late, the best they can do is fire Cashman and start a talent search for an experienced baseball executive. Even if this obvious move was actually made, this is a rebuilding and it will take several years. It is said that New York teams can’t afford the luxury of rebuilding, this team can’t afford not to.

    13. KPOcala
      August 11th, 2013 | 2:09 am

      They can fire this person and that, but how many “proven” GM’s are out there? And how many people would the argument that will be raised that, “MR. X” ‘would make a “great Gm” only to fall on their face, after another 8 or so years pass. Not to mention the people that they would want to bring with them. As Bill James once wrote about getting rid of players, you ‘don’t make a change, for the sake of it, you have to bring in someone better’. And that also goes for hiring a GM, and a whole new network of scouts, coaches, coordinators, physical therapist, and trainers, doctors, and so on. Just how do you go about hiring a “sure thing”? The guys you probably want, aren’t going anywhere. And the roadside is littered with “boy geniuses” that looked great for 2-3 years. Hal running the show like he was running a chain of hotels, along with the “bag man” Levine, and of course “Cowboy Hank” could have easily destroyed a Branch Rickey…. I’d like to hear actual suggestions, and the rational, including who they should hire as their support staff. And it makes crazy that Cano hasn’t been traded, like two weeks ago……

    14. August 11th, 2013 | 7:19 am

      KPOcala wrote:

      They can fire this person and that, but how many “proven” GM’s are out there? And how many people would the argument that will be raised that, “MR. X” ‘would make a “great Gm” only to fall on their face, after another 8 or so years pass.

      You never know, until you try.
      I know, 100%, that, if they ever replace Cashman, the next guy could be worse. That risk is always there. And, we have seen it, many times, with other teams, where they fire someone and the replacement is a joke. But, until you take that risk, you’ll never have the chance to improve. If the Yankees were never willing to fire their GM, for the risk of the next guy being worse, then Gene Michael never would have been hired for the job. And, the kid in Tampa got his job because the Rays were not afraid to fire the guy before him. Ditto the kid in Texas. All the Yankees would need to do is raise the HELP WANTED sign and the candidates would present themselves, and quickly. Who wouldn’t want to be GM of this franchise, esp now that the old man is dead and you can last forever, like Cashman.

    15. Corey
      August 11th, 2013 | 8:58 am

      KPOcala wrote:

      Hi Hal! Wait’ll next year, at least the average fan can pick up cheap seats behind home plate……………..

      WOuldn’t it be something if the moat was actually full most of the time next year because people could actually afford the tix on the secondary market?

    16. Corey
      August 11th, 2013 | 9:14 am

      Evan3457 wrote:

      All while spending large sums of money, which some people believe is a guarantee of pennants and titles.

      Giving Pujols and Hamilton money were as no-brainer of moves as signing CC Burnett and Tex…oh wait

    17. Mr. October
      August 11th, 2013 | 11:17 am

      Evan3457 wrote:

      Phillies

      2006: 8th in NL in payroll, 2nd in NL East
      2007: 7th in NL in payroll, Division Champs
      2008: 6th in NL in payroll, Won World Series
      2009: 3rd in NL in payroll, Won NL Pennant
      2010: 2nd in NL in payroll, Won Division, lost NLCS
      2011: 1st in NL in payroll, Won Division, lost NLDS
      2012: 1st in NL in payroll, 3rd in NL East
      2013: 2nd in NL in payroll, 4th in NL East

      See the pattern?
      Probably not.

      The pattern I see is a team with one of the highest payrolls in the National League and with one of the top pitching staffs in the NL in most years (2008-12) and the best team ERA in 2011, having one of the most successful records in the National League from 2006-13, and a team with “massive injuries” in 2013. And a more successful record than any GM in New York from 2006-13.

      I don’t know what pattern you see.

    18. Mr. October
      August 11th, 2013 | 11:25 am

      Interesting point: the signing of a “headcase” in Hamilton with well-publicized problems in Texas would appear to have been an assumption of risk that has not worked out for LA after 5 months.

      if Cashman did his due diligence in researching Burnett’s background (eg the less-publicized problems he had in Florida), the signing of a “headcase” in Burnett would appear to have been poor judgment as well that did not work out for NY after more than 3 years, although less of a risk given the financial resources of the Yankees in comparison to the Angels.

      Not giving money to Pujols certainly was a no-brainer for St. Louis, who let him walk rather that sign him to a contract for the term the Angels signed him for and the money.

      The Cardinals have won how many pennants since 2005? 2? The Yankees? 1? With the Cardinals spending less than 50% of the money the Yankees spent?
      And St. Louis is only 4 games out of first place and does not have a pitcher such as Sabathia with an ERA of 4.73 earning an average annual salary of $24 million on the books until 2017.

    19. KPOcala
      August 11th, 2013 | 1:07 pm

      @ Corey: You know, in a way it would be worth it, from my point view, not to mention others. My dad’s family roots are in NYC, but I’ve never visited, and something always “happens” that keeps me from going up there. Now THAT would make it IMPOSSIBLE to stop me ;)

    20. KPOcala
      August 11th, 2013 | 1:12 pm

      @ Steve L.: Fair enough, wonder if Frank Wren would be interested? But, after years of writing here that Cashman got blame/credit for things out of his control, he’s indicted by the shape of the farm system. For a year or two I was sure that he’d be vindicated. Part was bad luck, but after awhile….. ‘I came to see the great Yankee rookies’. ‘But there ARE no great Yankee rookies.’ ‘I was misguided…’ With apologies to “Casablanca” ;)

    21. Ricketson
      August 11th, 2013 | 7:04 pm

      Evan3457 wrote:

      It’s amazing the way you think the points you make prove your position, when they actually prove mine…

      Phillies
      2006: 8th in NL in payroll, 2nd in NL East
      2007: 7th in NL in payroll, Division Champs
      2008: 6th in NL in payroll, Won World Series
      2009: 3rd in NL in payroll, Won NL Pennant
      2010: 2nd in NL in payroll, Won Division, lost NLCS
      2011: 1st in NL in payroll, Won Division, lost NLDS
      2012: 1st in NL in payroll, 3rd in NL East
      2013: 2nd in NL in payroll, 4th in NL East
      See the pattern?
      Probably not.

      Philadelphia lost to the 2010 World Champions and the 2011 World Champions – 2 World Champions. John Cashman’s son did not lose to a World Champion from 2006-13 and won 1 less League Championship than Philadelphia.

      Next example of how the points I make prove yours?

    22. KPOcala
      August 11th, 2013 | 8:46 pm

      Bill James in his first historical abstract, as well as subsequent book, go es into the “deal with devil” that teams make when using free agency to build a winner. I might add (I haven’t read the articles in some time,so I may be repeating James) that when a team lays out really large sums for players, not only is there less left to fill out a roster and loss of draft position, we don’t know how much ownership will cutback on farm and support staff. It’s possible, and we’ll never know, that Cashman is much better than given credit for, but has his hands tied with the people that he can hire for scouting, etc…. As fans, it’s fun to pick apart our teams’ failure when things go wrong (well, not That much fun, but cathartic), but like any big business, good luck getting to the “TRUTH” of what goes on. Most of the crowd reading this are old enough to remember HUGE companies going down the tubes, none of us know, “the rest of the story”. I’m not Cashman’s apologist, but I do have a sense of “fairness” in the way I view things, and I doubt any of us really has a clue as to what goes on in the ‘bowels of the business’. Probably for the best too, for us it’s a “game”, an “escape”, not a business model to try and analyse with nothing to analyse……

    23. PHMDen
      August 11th, 2013 | 11:59 pm

      Steve L. wrote:

      All the Yankees would need to do is raise the HELP WANTED sign and the candidates would present themselves, and quickly. Who wouldn’t want to be GM of this franchise, esp now

      Agreed. I’ll be happy to pick the candidates up at the airport, drive them to the Yankees’ corporate offices, etc. at my own expense…

    24. Tuttle
      August 12th, 2013 | 12:14 am

      Steve L. wrote:

      And, we have seen it, many times, with other teams, where… the replacement is a joke.

      We saw it with this team in 1998.

    25. Evan3457
      August 12th, 2013 | 12:48 am

      Mr. October wrote:

      Evan3457 wrote:
      Phillies
      2006: 8th in NL in payroll, 2nd in NL East
      2007: 7th in NL in payroll, Division Champs
      2008: 6th in NL in payroll, Won World Series
      2009: 3rd in NL in payroll, Won NL Pennant
      2010: 2nd in NL in payroll, Won Division, lost NLCS
      2011: 1st in NL in payroll, Won Division, lost NLDS
      2012: 1st in NL in payroll, 3rd in NL East
      2013: 2nd in NL in payroll, 4th in NL East
      See the pattern?
      Probably not.
      The pattern I see is a team with one of the highest payrolls in the National League and with one of the top pitching staffs in the NL in most years (2008-12) and the best team ERA in 2011, having one of the most successful records in the National League from 2006-13, and a team with “massive injuries” in 2013. And a more successful record than any GM in New York from 2006-13.
      I don’t know what pattern you see.

      You see it, you’re simply too dishonest to admit it.

    26. Evan3457
      August 12th, 2013 | 12:50 am

      Ricketson wrote:

      Evan3457 wrote:
      It’s amazing the way you think the points you make prove your position, when they actually prove mine…
      Phillies
      2006: 8th in NL in payroll, 2nd in NL East
      2007: 7th in NL in payroll, Division Champs
      2008: 6th in NL in payroll, Won World Series
      2009: 3rd in NL in payroll, Won NL Pennant
      2010: 2nd in NL in payroll, Won Division, lost NLCS
      2011: 1st in NL in payroll, Won Division, lost NLDS
      2012: 1st in NL in payroll, 3rd in NL East
      2013: 2nd in NL in payroll, 4th in NL East
      See the pattern?
      Probably not.
      Philadelphia lost to the 2010 World Champions and the 2011 World Champions – 2 World Champions. John Cashman’s son did not lose to a World Champion from 2006-13 and won 1 less League Championship than Philadelphia.

      Not relevant.

    27. KPOcala
      August 12th, 2013 | 1:52 am

      The Yankees have to always spend. They have entertainment and baseball competition, the fans, including most of “us” would go crazy doing the “down on the farm talk” for five years. Hard to have it both ways, guys.

    28. PHMDen
      August 12th, 2013 | 11:00 am

      KPOcala wrote:

      The Yankees have to always spend. They have entertainment and baseball competition…

      It’s not the spending, it’s the manner of spending.

    29. KPOcala
      August 12th, 2013 | 11:31 am

      @ PHMDen:Hard to argue with…

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